Part III
Q- This is too much, especially for the teacher. Let us not go beyond to other dimensions or extensions.
A- No. 12 says the big and small are equal. Of course, we know His example of the solar system and ant hill. What is its import?
Q- It means the same amount of energy goes into the making of both. In addition, that is the entirety of Brahman.
A- Here lies one of the unspoken truths or secrets, rarely noted by the reader.
Q- What is it?
A- When we hear all are Brahman, we know all are made of Brahman. It never struck me until this minute that each of us, as well as each thing, is entire Brahman, a whole universe comprising all the planes from the gross material to the Transcendent.
Q- To realise Brahman is, then, to know ourselves as an infinite universe and cosmos?
A- Till now I never saw it in that light.
Q- I understand that a dull boy and an intelligent boy are endowed with the same energy and, if one brings the required expertise to bear upon, the dull can equally become intelligent.
A- In a school, it is an achievement.
Q- At home, if a retarded child can be made normal, that is a miracle. That much of application is apparent.
A- The same principle holds good in changing a losing concern into a profitable one.
Q- Though they are all vast achievements in life, they are petty before the pregnant impact of this statement. It means I am one centre of the universe that can have intercourse in the spiritual plane with all such universes.
A- It means more. I can see all those universes inside. He goes to the final step, one that the list missed, that the Spirit can move Matter. (p 1039 of The Life Divine)
Q- That is a Mastery only God has now. If we, as we are, seek it, it will be ambition. To seek it rightly, one sheds his ego.
A- Even the principle that Jivatma is Paramatma is about this. The process is simple to describe.
Shed the ego.
See the World Purusha individualising in us.
See it outside and inside.
Inside you can see that the world Purusha is truly the Transcendent.
Q- Only two have shed their ego. Even for the first step one has to become the third person in the world.
A- What about the Vedic Rishis who have shed their ego?
Q- During their time, Mind itself was not there. The ego they shed was the vital, physical ego, not the mental or spiritual ego.
A- The argument in the descent that the physical ego is more difficult to shed will not apply to them, as there was no descent in those times.
Q- In our list of principles, naturally we will not cover the methods, strategies, required conditions, etc.
A- Yes, consecration, Silence, surrender, equality, being, becoming, knowing, enjoying, understanding, etc., are not covered here.
Q- These are methods. What is a method?
A- A method is that which converts energy into result.
Q- Why did you include being as a method?
A- In Supermind the aim is to be. Also in Sat, Sat exists not by energy or understanding but by being.
Q- Is Silence a condition or method?
A- It is a condition. In silent will we use it as a method.
Q- If principles are implemented by methods what others are there in the process?
A- It is true that in a plane - e.g., mental plane - there is a condition, which is mental existence, there is energy, which is mental energy, there is a method of thinking that gives understanding, there are faculties like memory, etc. and there are results, e.g. knowledge.
Q- So, plane, condition or status, energy, method, faculty, result are the things we have to study apart from the principles.
A- What then is a principle?
Q- A principle is an order in which acts take place in a given condition.
A- Can’t we say a principle is the wider law or method governing a wider area?
Q- Maybe we can say all these are parts of which creation is the whole. We give convenient names.
A- I wish our discussion is comprehensive as far as possible.
Q- Then we will stay on one principle forever, but it has the advantage of fully being introduced to The Life Divine.
A- It is possible to get all the aspects in all details from this discussion if we are patient and persistent. Or, one may prefer to get at the essentials and start reading and develop as we go through the book.
Q- I felt the most difficulty in a few chapters, of which Matter is one.
A- That is a chapter on which I spent years and finally understood the key sentence on p.237 about creation of Matter. The rest remained ununderstood for a long time.
Q- It is there HE explains the formation of ego.
A- Yes, it is on the next page.
Q- Most of our difficulties issue from the lack of training to read.
A- Yes.
Q- It is a major defect.
A- It never occurred to me for several years to ask myself what HE was explaining. No wonder I don’t understand.
Q- When I came to ask that question, I had no answer.
A- In this chapter, HE declares HE explains the formation of Matter.
Q- The explanation is in pp. 236, 237 and 238. Finally, when the arguments were less defying I found that there is no Matter but it is only Mind’s appearance.
A- Yes. That is what I too thought at first. Only in the view of Matter as explained on p.80, it is confusing. Viewing it from Mind, the confusion disappears.
Q- Mind views Spirit. It views through the senses. Mind sees the Spirit through senses as Matter. So, Matter exists only for the vision of Mind, not elsewhere.
A- That was what I thought too. There is a truth in it. If we persist in it, there is the danger of our landing in Mayavada, as essentially that is what they say.
Q- I never thought of it. How else are we to look at it?
A- Whatever is created in any plane is not confined to that plane.It is not as if it exists only in that plane.
Q- I see now. It exists in that plane too. From each plane it looks different. We must look at it not from this plane or that but from the whole.
A- For Mind it is Matter. For the Absolute, it is the Absolute unfolding in creation or involution.
Q- Once we know the construction which is described in the fly leaves, it is a revelation, but the outline of the construction and details of the chapters are far apart. It takes time to abridge them.
A- What is interesting in the chapter Matter is the masterful way in which HE summarises the position of Matter as Delight of Self-existence. He does so in the last paragraph.
Q- A question I always had is Matter is Sat. He calls it Delight of existence. He used the small ‘e’ for existence.
A- It is a question, of course.
Q- Can anyone resolve it for me?
A- Sat inverts itself as Matter. Ananda inverts itself as Psychic. The question is how does Delight become Matter or Sat.
Q- Bliss is the sensation of Sat when it becomes conscious of its existence. Delight is Sachchidananda expressing Bliss in the objects. HE actually says objectless Delight expressing in objects is the aim of creation.
A- Bliss is Delight of Self-Existence. Delight is Delight of Self-existence as this existence is here.
Q- Let us take that last paragraph. There is a conceptive Self-extension of being. It becomes substance. Mind creates matter out of this substance by division and aggregation. This Matter is Being or Brahman. It is a form or the force of conscious Being. It is delight of being offering itself to the secret consciousness. It is an object of sensation. It tempts the hidden godhead. Matter is Sachchidananda represented to His mental experience. It is a formal basis of objective knowledge, action and delight of existence.
A- Matter is basis of knowledge, action and delight. That is how Sachchidananda inverts itself.
Q- Something is clear. Let us wait till the end.
A- I am trying to think aloud to understand.
Q- You say as Sat is inclusive of consciousness and Bliss, Matter here in the reverse order is inclusive of knowledge and delight.
A- Put that way, it clears my doubt.
Q- My doubt remains.
A- Sat reverses as Matter. Matter, in evolution, reverses again to become Sat. That is the Delight for which HE started creation. His getting the Delight HE sought is seen in Matter beginning to evolve.
Q- It is clearer still, but not fully. In the previous para HE says it is the status of Matter, not Matter itself.
A- Matter is, as everything else, in both statuses of Being and Becoming. First HE says the division that ends in unatomic extension is the supramental status where Matter formed is in status, not in motion. To be in motion there needs to be separation as well as space between two things. The separation is created by the division and aggregation. There is space between two aggregates, making motion possible.
Q- Your explanation does not help.
A- Let us wait. Let us go to No.35 — ‘The Absolute’ never chooses to cease being the Absolute.
Q- If all is Brahman, if Brahman became the world, if Brahman inverted itself to become creation, it is simple from his analogy of golden vessels from gold to understand the above statement.
A- As long as we are able to see evil as absolute, there is no difficulty.
Q- To understand there is no difficulty. It is the senses that see. They do not.
A- In other words, the difficulty is to make the senses see what mind sees.
Q- Does it amount to saying that the intellect is in the gross plane and senses in the subtle plane?
A- It is. When the body sees, it emerges in the causal plane.
Q- Is there no example?
A- Magic is in the subtle plane. The magician takes us to the subtle plane, makes us see what he wants us to see and later we come back to the gross plane.
Q- Sri Aurobindo says we can see the earth going round the sun in the universal and transcendental planes.
A- The subtle plane when it extends to the whole universe reveals the earth going round. The Transcendental is in the causal plane.
Q- Only in yogic experience can one see them, perhaps.
A- There are moments in meditation when such things are revealed. It is safe for us to confine ourselves to mental explanations.
Q- Spirit is a plane where we are free to quote what they have experienced.
A- For us to fully appreciate this statement we can think of some examples. An Indian or Muslim wherever he goes and lives, basically remains an Indian or Muslim.
Q- That anyone can readily agree with. What he cannot see is the Indian in
A- Analogies are helpful only in one point, not thoroughly.
Q- We talk of the 3rd dimension so much. Can we not explain this statement through that?
A- The Brahman in our first dimension (these dimensions are valid only for our discussion and nowhere else) is Eternal, Infinite, Silent, immobile, inside us. In its second dimension it is Nature, sky, men, world, etc., - Becoming, Prakriti, created world, etc., where it is Brahman in essence as well as appearance but does not appear to us, to our mind, as Brahman. In our third dimension again the Nature, sky, man, and world reveal themselves as Brahman even in its appearance, the Marvel HE speaks of. This is only words to us, not a reality.
Q- This is more satisfactory. Is this what Sri Aurobindo saw in Alipore Jail?
A- Yes. Mother says it is Supramental vision. The Viswarupa darsan that
Q- When a child looks back at its life, it likes many things and does not like many other things. A psychologist, a yogi, an educationist will KNOW that every incident in the child’s life was an occasion for education.
A- If the child itself becomes one such, he will surely see that every little incident FULLY played its part in educating him. It serves some purpose, but not striking enough.
Q- We can offer the scientific argument that everything is made up of atoms or everything is energy.
A- That is better. Still they do not serve the purpose of an illuminating example. Let us move to another one. No.51 is ‘Reality includes the One and the Many’.
Q- We can compare the all-powerful government to the ONE and all the other activities of the society such as residential life, agriculture, trade, transport, education, etc. etc., the myriad non-government life to the Many - Jivatma, the Nature - and then say neither the government nor the nongovernment is the whole. The whole is the society that includes government and non-government.
A- This is a good illustration.
Q- We need to explain the position of the tradition and the position of Sri Aurobindo and draw the distinction point by point, as this is of vast importance.
A- For the present, this much looks good. As we said earlier, they could not see the whole with the mind. Hence, all the arguments they offered were amiss.
Q- I wish we restate the position of Sri Aurobindo at least as a summary so that all our discussions will more effectively reflect that background.
A- If you consider the Christian theology of one human life for the soul where the character of his life decides whether he goes to heaven or hell and the Indian position that it is out of original sin a soul takes its birth in the human body to work out its karma in innumerable lives to be liberated from the bondage to birth, Sri Aurobindo’s position gains in clarity.
Q- Sri Aurobindo says Man is a conscient being evolved out of inconscient Matter and half-conscient life, seeking to evolve into a Supramental Being. He lives in a world of God’s creation, rather God’s revelation, of ignorance, suffering and pain with the choice of shedding the ego and the ignorance so that he may witness the unfolding marvel and continue his spiritual evolution.
A- Once the framework is placed around our discussion, the essential confusions are less. The statement No.39 is of capital importance.
Q- Who on earth will agree there is nothing negative? The bombardments of wars are dreadful. The nest of gangsters is NOT positive. Children who desert their parents are no angels. A trusted friend turning mercenary is no glory. Crucifixion is no marvel. Polluted atmosphere is not inviting.
A- Their number is legion.
Q- Our one argument is they are the appearances behind which lurks good and God. It is not appealing.
A- If we can show the gangsters are gods, a virago wife is a sight to see, her words are music, the argument will be appreciated.
Q- I think that possibility is there somewhere, not to be inferred.
A- A teenager who has imbibed his own latest ‘ideal’ denouncing his parents as his utter ruin, will be to a learned, wise parent an expression of deep affection inversely delivered. To his vision of wisdom, nothing but the boy’s abiding love will be seen.
Q- Rarely we see that circumstance between a couple who are passionately in love when a prejudice arises, leading to an ugly outburst from the less educated or less cultured partner. The ruling passion of love coupled with the knowledge that the other is smarting under a wound inflicted by a false information, receives every expression of the outburst with a supreme sense of humour. Each sting delivered will be seen as a greater bondage forged.
A- They are rare but not non-existent. To these people, the idea that there is nothing negative will explain itself.
Q- Darcy, in Pride and Prejudice, took the abuses of
A- He endeavoured to rise to her expectations. They were not missiles sweetly landing on him at that moment. Rhett Butler in ‘Gone with the Wind’ fully enjoys the rascality of his ladylove Scarlet. Here also he loves her in spite of her bad character. He does say to her, coming closer to our theme, that he loved her for the rascal she was.
Q- The Marvel is the next step. These are very close to it. A workshop littered with scraps and broken parts, dirt, etc. is a sore to the eyes. The mechanic who has just then completed the repair of a machine and removed it from there will KNOW exactly the marvellous role played by each bit there in making the machine work. To the eyes of his whole vision - the finished machine and the scraps - every bit is a wonder.
A- The theory is there is the whole, neither positive nor negative. For us the village is positive, the surrounding forests are negative. It is the forest that brings in the rain, supplies fuel, fodder, and healing herbs. As it hides the robbers and wild animals, to us it is negative. Negative forest is a social or village conception. Beyond in life, the village and forest are one.
Q- As we go along seeing this truth in various situations, it will render the principle here clear. The idea of void and zero is to be explained.
A- Philosophically, it is a revolutionary concept. HE says there is no zero.
Q- He also says that about what we do not know we have a habit of saying ‘it is nothing’. A library is of zero value to an uneducated man. In his mind, he does not think that there is something not useful to him, but he believes there is nothing. This is the characteristic way of mind’s functioning.
A- Sri Aurobindo draws our attention to this human attitude in two or three other places too.
Q- It was striking to me when I first read them. They are important arguments too.
A- They are very important. We shall take it up for discussion if the circumstances permit. No. 36 is the law of contradictions, HE says, is not the final arbiter.
Q- As Unity is the final law, contradictions, though they can serve up to a point, will not hold good to the end.
A- Neither in our local life, nor in our ancient literature can we deny this.
Q- When Indira was defeated, she went to Morarji the Prime Minister to request him not to harm her son. After the war was over Dharma went to Dhritharashtra and Gandhari for their blessings. Romeo and Juliet demonstrates the principle.
A- He who emphasises hatred will be compelled by life to go to him whom he hates. Hatred is inverse attraction.
Q- Spiritually it is untenable as Sat and Asat rose out of Brahman. Life never upholds it. In 1942 the Allies who had all joined to crush
A- The Chinese proverb about today’s friends and tomorrow’s enemies is well known.
Q- Apart from examples and the theory, is there anything else we need to know here?
A- The warp and woof are not contradictions. Together they go to make the cloth. Man and woman are not opposites, though they are of opposite sexes. They are the hub of biological creation. Because boys and girls are segregated, it does not prevent them from coming together in marriage. Man developed the law of contradictions out of the two essential elements for all creation.
Q- As we spoke earlier, we need to see this truth everywhere in life. What do we have to say about No.3? Not to stop the inquiry.
A- This is something obvious, but because the Rishis have stopped the inquiry in the middle, man has to accept karma.
Q- Is it right to say mind cannot take the inquiry to the end?
A- As mind has no capacity to see the other side, somewhere it has to stop the inquiry. Where life crashes on it, forcing it to see the results that reveal the other side, mind does see the other side. Until then mind is unable to see it.
Q- The Boxers in
A- To reverse the argument and apply it to prosperity and genius will be helpful.
Q- When the average income from an acre is Rs.10,000, we see one man makes 2 lakhs from flowers or vegetables. It never occurs to the whole village to go for vegetables. If ever people take to it, they do so in less than an acre.
A- In a school, we see a few boys securing centum. Neither to the teacher nor to the boys does it ever occur that each boy should secure centum. It is a form of unconsciousness.
Q- Creation of genius will benefit from that principle, for sure.
A- Asian poverty can thus be eradicated.
Q- It is the Overmind that takes the single possibility given to it by the Supermind to its uttermost possibility, till it becomes unique and infinitesimal beyond which it cannot be divided.
A- ‘Do not stop the inquiry in the middle’ can otherwise be said as ‘go to the Overmind’.
Q- Yes, yes. Now we understand His language. When we are asked to reconcile contradiction, He says, ‘look at it from the Supermind’.
A- There must be a way of presenting Sri Aurobindo in the language of ordinary human beings.
Q- I wish someone tries.
A- The last chapter will serve this purpose better.
Q- It is best summarised as:
Know you are more than mind.
Realise what you know.
It takes you from the earth to the universe and beyond.
It cannot be mental, partial, unconscious, weak, local.
It will be Supramental, full, conscious, powerful and universal.
For these reasons it has to be inner and not outer.
No method the world so far knows can get it.
HE gives you a method the world does not know.
It is Transformation.
The method to attain to it is also unknown so far.
It is surrender of Brahman, not human surrender.
Achieve it, choose your style, simple or complex.
Evolve in knowledge, not anymore in Ignorance.
A- It is comprehensive. Explaining anything in this context will be admirable.
Q- Surely, it will be intelligible. This is manna from heaven.
A- I believe every chapter can be so spoken.
Q- Maybe the whole of The Life Divinecan be brought down to the language of the common man.
A- It is largely possible.
Q- Now that the world is moving on these lines feebly, man will be receptive.
A- I believe man is ready to accept the idea of conquering pain as he has been witnessing it.
Q- When he sees a factory producing all that an entire country can consume, the idea of practical infinity is less unconvincing.
A- He certainly sees the phenomenon of children in his own house knowing more than he does. Genius may not be that distant in his conception.
Q- People at the age of 60 suddenly see their company or government department presided over by a 30 year old or even 25 year old person.
A- Events have subconsciously been preparing humankind.
Q- Plague and smallpox have been eliminated from the face of the earth. Democracy, universal education, longevity, and human rights have done a lot so far.
A- People who are on the Internet will be able to believe in anything.
Q- They see the impossible as possible. There they have entered not the global picture, but the very universal arena.
A- It is the ever-lasting day of Savitri where Yama, Lord of Death is not merely dead, but has been transformed into a being of Light.
Q- I should like to take up those principles that dwell on the subliminal moving the surface. Our position is any principle will touch upon it.
A- As we just mentioned, it is important to know how different HE is and what the difference is. As a matter of fact, you can call this ‘subliminal yoga’, as there is integration only at that level.
Q- The world is starting to treat erstwhile slaves as present day equals, the great social values of the past as social crimes. They all start apologising for every past event then honoured.
A- It is the subliminal coming to the surface. Even the terrorist and murderer are treated with sympathy.
Q- We know in life several instances where life takes a course different from man’s ideas. Are they occasions for the subliminal? A rich man, the VIP of a big town while negotiating for a marriage alliance for his younger brother with a poor relative, felt all the prestige of his post and wealth. The poor relative was insistent and assertive in an unbecoming fashion. He was dismissed by the rich man peremptorily. In the very normal course, it is the poor relative who would hang on to the other. All circumstances changed in an unheard of fashion, and the rich man was compelled to go to the poor man and beg for the rejected alliance.
A- How do we see this?
Q- My question is whether the rich man was compelled by his subliminal to go against the normal course.
A- This is a good example. What the rich man wants is humility which his subliminal teaches him.
Q- The conflict has a purpose, is it not? The conflict between the surface and the subliminal.
A- Evolution has created ignorance and perfected it on the surface. That surface ignorance getting knowledge is knowledge emerging out of Ignorance.
Q- So, if the surface of the rich man learns humility, he progresses towards greater knowledge and his subliminal pushes him to do so.
A- What is the role of man here, his mind?
Q- His mind must choose knowledge instead of Ignorance.
A- Does it mean the subliminal has all the knowledge?
Q- No, it has more knowledge than the surface.
A- What has all the knowledge?
Q- The Superconscient.
A- It is only in Timelessness.
Q- Then the Superconscient evolving or expressing in the inconscient or the conscient has all the knowledge.
A- It is the third dimension, the birth of Brahman, Brahma Jananam.
Q- To bring any argument to the third dimension - Brahma Jananam - will explain anything.
A- It is true. It is one essential way.
Q- What are the other ways to arrive at the final knowledge?
A- If you ask for a method, it is surrender. If what you ask for is an explanation, it is Fullness.
Q- What are the ways - the several ways - of arriving at fullness?
A- Rising to the Supermind, emerging out of the seven ignorances, ability to help another find his soul, triple transformation, and to be are the several ways.
Q- In a sense, each chapter ends in telling us that method in its own way.
A- Why not put all of them together?
Q- Shed the ego, find the Supreme inside.
A- Can we dwell on this theme, ‘Find the Supreme inside’?
Q- This Supreme is not the Absolute?
A- Nor is this the Superconscient.
Q- Why not distinguish them both from the Supreme?
A- The Absolute is outside creation.
Q- The Supreme is the first step in creation called by Sri Aurobindo the Self-Conscious Being.
A- When the Conscious self-absorbs itself, the Superconscient is created which is oblivious on the surface but is aware of itself inside.
Q- The Supreme is a status before any of its extensions — cosmic extension or objective or Time or three aspects or even Sachchidananda.
A- If we attain the Supreme, what about Supermind?
Q- Supermind is Truth acquiring consciousness, but Supreme is an earlier state, the earliest of states.
A- Why not say ‘Shed the ego, rise to the Supermind’?
Q- That is all right.
A- Can we say we have fairly covered the territory?
Q- Yes, a bird’s eye view.
A- Any detail from any chapter will add to the illumination but the basic outline is referred to in several ways.
Q- I wish we bring out some striking features of this yoga even if we have touched upon it till now, in such a fashion that it throws light on some essentials in the depth.
A- Can you illustrate what you have in mind?
Q- The creation of Matter by the senses of the Mind is one such.
A- Action revealing Purusha by analysis detaching from it is another one.
Q- His occult link, the secret of rising to the Supermind is one.
A- Reality including the One and the Many is another.
Q- These are in our list.
A- Not all. Whether it is in the list or not, I wish that none of them are left out in our discussion.
Q- Man’s irresponsive attitude to the Hour is important.
A- His answer to the scientist refuting chance and iron order but explaining the infinite variation and the cosmic determinism is such.
Q- Along with that goes Mind over Matter. What is His answer?
A- The Infinite emerging out of the finite naturally will have infinite variation. It looks like a perfect explanation that combines chance or iron order.
Q- How?
A- Infinite variation appears to be chance. As it moves towards a goal of infinite from the finite, the iron order emerges.
Q- Cosmic determinism?
A- As the creation is Self-conception, every determinism therein is also Self-conception. It is best seen in our own work.
Q- We speak of it many times. I too explain it that way, but it does not stay in the mind, why?
A- There is no apperceptive mass in the mind to receive it and retain it. We know what we do, but we do not think of it in terms of creative process.
Q- I think like this, it should be nice to take issues of life that touch us deeply and explain them in his terms. E.g. People in
A- Indians had no knowledge that those deaths could have been prevented.
Q- Does it come under the principle that man does not know what he lost or what he gained?
A- It is unconsciousness. Today the
Q- It means superstition has the same force in any century. Perhaps like the elements it is always the same.
A- You mean the chemical elements.
Q- Yes.
A- In Chapter 9 of the first book Infinity of space and eternity of Time are explained. There HE says at no point of Time or Space can you say there is nothing ahead. So there is no beginning. So also, there is no end. Can we not see the same in production?
Q- What you say is true, but how to explain it?
A- A piece of land produces some grains. How can you show it has infinite capacity to produce?
Q- If it is true, there must be a way to explain it.
A- It may be there, but I do not know it.
Q- Year after year, the land produces, is it not? A machine too behaves like that. But this will not be satisfying.
A- Our speech is infinite in the sense mind can infinitely produce speech.
Q- It is the same as the land. But the example can serve our purpose if we can draw grain non-stop from the land.
A- The principle is everything on earth is truly infinite. There is nothing finite.
Q- If we can show or explain it satisfactorily, that will be the practical concept of infinity.
A- Compare the present with the 15th century in terms of human needs.
Q- Human needs are infinite. The secret there is the more need we create for ourselves, the greater it grows.
A- This is the secret of Infinity.
Q- What?
A- If something can grow, as the human needs, — it feeds grows - it grows on what it feeds — it is infinity.
Q- Such an element is there everywhere. To be able to see that is to know Infinity. To know Infinity is to know Brahman.
A- Anything retains the absoluteness in some form.
Q- If the absolute is there in some form, we must be able to know it.
A- To discover the Infinite in finite things is the penultimate step to discover the Absolute - Brahman - in it.
Q- Maybe only those who have discovered the Brahman inside will be able to see the Brahman outside.
A- That is generally true, but not mandatory. Maybe seeing Brahman inside is a bar to seeing Him outside in the sense any realisation unless given up is a bar to further ones.
Q- Can we say the Master Keys are knowing the Infinite and Brahman in life?
A- Yes, we can say so.
Q- Are you not sure of them?
A- The higher the goal, the greater is the difficulty but its other side is the higher, the more accessible.
Q- It may be misunderstood as easier.
A- In a sense it is, as top political posts are more accessible than top administrative posts.
Q- What is more accessible may not necessarily be more easily attainable.
A- Brahma Jananam, the third dimension, the evolving Brahman, the Infinite in the finite, etc. is more easily shown to people than less exalted realisations.
Q- You mean explained to them or shown to their perception?
A- Either way.
Q- Whatever do you mean?
A- Should the person who wants to explain KNOW it fully, he should be able to explain it easier than other things. If the person has realised it, he will be able to reach their perception.
Q- Making pupils understand is easier than making them memorise the lessons.
A- Exactly. The greater comprehension and greater realisation lend itself to easier explanation and easier communication.
Q- The idea itself is of great interest. If we ever reach that point, well, it is something, not a mere understanding of The Life Divine. If this discussion will ever lead to that revelation, it will be great.
A- That secret lies in the spirit of the discussion. No. 70 says the aim of Brahman in creation is to express the inexpressible in perfect form created by the Force. My question is Form and Force are of the Force, not of the Being. The aim is Being of the Becoming. How do Form and Being of any description go together?
Q- It sounds as if the unspoken aim is to raise the Force to the level of Being in the name of Being of the Becoming.
A- Yes, that is obvious. Being that becomes Force in involution becomes Being of a higher order in evolution as Brahman is reaching a higher order of joy.
Q- He wants the consciousness of the body to grow so that the evolved soul need not seek another body. The consciousness of the form grows to perfection as the consciousness of the body grows to immortality.
A- Shall I say the consciousness of our discussion should grow to perfection for us to hit at the Master Secret?
Q- One thing is clear. When the Master Secret is discovered, it will be SIMPLE, elegant, easy of perception, easy to communicate.
A- What is perfection of Form?
Q- Being - Consciousness - Force - Form are the stages. Form rising in quality will be forceful. Rising still further, it will be conscious of itself, at the level of perception, easy to communicate.
A- Then each form, each force, each thing must have a being. Evolution ends in the Self-conscious Being as the Being of FORM. In that case, life is the being of Force.
Q- The musician and the dancer touch their climax when a similar thing happens, if not at the level of Being, but at the level of their performance. Maybe it touches the vital being of the song or dance.
A- Then we should seek for the being of the FORM of comprehension to reach a wider receptivity.
Q- The third dimension we speak of is the being of the FORM of anything or any activity.
A- The third dimension is now philosophically explained.
Q- Philosophic definition becoming yogic explanation may achieve the goal.
A- To explain a thing in life, define it as a proposition, reveal it as a yogic phenomenon, i.e., to give a thing a defining expansiveness in all the 8 planes - Sat to Matter - is to fully know it, possess it and enjoy it.
Q- No. 45 speaks of four types of knowledge. Our aim is to have all knowledge.
A- The highest knowledge, knowledge by identity is capable of ousting all the other three. I am sure it is of the Superconscient. It is the Superconscient expressing in Becoming.
Q- We know the surface knowledge of objects around us through our senses. The only example HE gives for knowledge of identity is the knowledge of someone that he is alive. We know we are alive. How do we know? HE says the sense of identity with the body for the soul gives that knowledge. The Rishi knows what is in another man’s mind without his speaking out. That is intuition. Subliminal knowledge of what is happening at a distance is already explained through an example.
A- Good. We understand the four types of knowledge. Is that all? Or do we have more to say here?
Q- There are ways of encouraging the higher types of knowledge, which will take us into the domain of yoga or yogic life. In a school of very young children we can look for these higher faculties and foster them. It is a very wide domain.
A- Not to exclude what is exceeded is No 6. At once we can say it makes for the whole. We have mentioned it in the context of moksha. This is a tall order in life. Yoga makes this goal impossible. For that very reason the Rishis took to the forest. We can discuss its aspects if there is any interest in trying it. Otherwise, it is obvious.
Q- It means having exceeded the mind, vital and body, we should not exclude them. Is that it?
A- Gandhiji was a great leader because having risen to the heights of a London educated barrister, he never wanted to be above, but came down to the masses, dressed like them, lived like them, felt like them. No leader was so great as Gandhiji. Einstein said we were fortunate to live when he walked on earth.
Q- Not to exclude what we have exceeded is to be like Gandhiji?
A- He represented Indian spirituality but fell short of the heights of Reality not then explored.
Q- He overlooked the strength of the dark imperative.
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